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start with symfony 2.0 [message #102455] Wed, 14 July 2010 11:07 Go to next message
richardf  is currently offline richardf
Messages: 2
Registered: July 2010
Location: Switzerland
Junior Member
hey there!

I'm looking for a powerfull php-framework and smyfony looks really great for my purpose.

But since Symfony 2.0 should be available in a few months, I'm not that motivated to learn Symfony 1.4...


So my question is:
Am I to stupid to find a real documentation, or isn't there any?
The only 2 things I can find are many articles how great symfony 2 is/will be and a bunch of examples, which are not helpfull to learn from scratch...


thanks!
Re: start with symfony 2.0 [message #102460 is a reply to message #102455 ] Wed, 14 July 2010 11:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
rschumacher  is currently offline rschumacher
Messages: 162
Registered: August 2007
Location: Switzerland
Senior Member
Hi Richard,

Symfony2 is still in heavy development (an alpha at best), so you may have to wait another while until documentation focused on newcomers will be available.

Your motivation (or lack of) for learning symfony 1.4 at this stage is of course your own decision.
I'd only mention that even though that Symfony 2 will not be backward-compatible to symfony 1.x, many of the philosophy and basic concepts of Symfony (view, controller, views, forms, etc) remain the same or similar. Yes, some other things will radically change.
Version 2 of the framework is a re-write that addresses the learnings from versions 1.x, but it is still Symfony. So what you learn now won't be obsolete in one year.

With regard to protection of your investments into symfony 1.4, there will most presumably be guidance available for smooth migration to Symfony2, or even some modules/bundles allowing to incorporate some parts into the Symfony2 framework.
As there are currently hundreds (or thousands?) of developers doing serious work with symfony 1.x, you won't find yourself alone once Symfony2 will be on the road... Wink

Regards RAPHAEL
Re: start with symfony 2.0 [message #102464 is a reply to message #102455 ] Wed, 14 July 2010 13:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
richardf  is currently offline richardf
Messages: 2
Registered: July 2010
Location: Switzerland
Junior Member
Hi Raphael,

Thanks for your answer.


Maybe I used the wrong term, as I said "start from scratch".
I'm experienced with MVC-Frameworks (like Zend, ASP.NET MVC and so on).
The Quick Tour is fine, but as it named itself: it's only a quick tour Smile

I'm looking for a documentation or a wikipedia-system (I'm quite sure documentation was made BEFORE codeing...?!) and not for books like "practical symfony".



Of course: the lack of my motivation is my problem: but it's hard to learn something, while you know there will be shortly a new system which is easier, faster and moer flexible...
Re: start with symfony 2.0 [message #102473 is a reply to message #102455 ] Wed, 14 July 2010 15:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
halfer  is currently offline halfer
Messages: 9535
Registered: January 2006
Location: West Midlands, UK
Faithful Member
@richardf - I know what you mean about motivation. Since my firm is still on 1.0 - which is, after all, still an excellent framework - we have not put the effort into keeping up with new releases. The overlapping nature of 1.4 support and the 2.0 release presents a professional dilemma, and not one just relating to individual motivation issues either: should I spend time now learning 1.4 only to need to re-learn everything for 2.0?

My solution is that, given the speed of development of symfony, it pays not to be too concerned about staying with the latest and greatest - unless there is particularly good reason to do so. Hence, I am now dipping my toe in the 1.4 water, and will catch up with 2.0 in a year or so. After all, 1.4 still has two and a half years still left to run in its LTS phase.

This is not to detract from 2.0, which I am sure will be an exciting release. I may even have a play with it at some point. But right now, I will put more effort into 1.4 expertise - anyway, it's all good experience!


Remember Palestine
Re: start with symfony 2.0 [message #102474 is a reply to message #102464 ] Wed, 14 July 2010 15:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
rschumacher  is currently offline rschumacher
Messages: 162
Registered: August 2007
Location: Switzerland
Senior Member
richardf wrote on Wed, 14 July 2010 13:46

I'm looking for a documentation or a wikipedia-system (I'm quite sure documentation was made BEFORE codeing...?!) and not for books like "practical symfony".

This discussion is currently going on for Symfony2, as in http://www.symfony-project.org/blog/2010/07/06/symfony2-docu mentation. The reactions illustrate (no really a surprise) the different opinions and tastes that exist on this issue.
Quote:

Of course: the lack of my motivation is my problem: but it's hard to learn something, while you know there will be shortly a new system which is easier, faster and moer flexible...

This problem won't ever get away: once "thing" version X is out, we will then see a very promising "thing" version X.1 or Y in the pipeline, and we'll be faltering again like today. While "thing" can stand for Symfony, PHP, Operating System, Iphone generation, navigation device, bike, car, and many more things in our life... Wink
Re: start with symfony 2.0 [message #103004 is a reply to message #102474 ] Fri, 23 July 2010 17:44 Go to previous message
esdart  is currently offline esdart
Messages: 1
Registered: July 2010
Location: Dallas TX, USA
Junior Member

Hello,

I am very new to PHP as I have spent the last 10 years as a Java Developer (and am now Sr Engineer at my company) - but I have encountered PHP while developing Facebook apps for a former employer. Now I am learning PHP in my spare time and after initially starting out with Zend I have switched to Symfony ( my first adversion to Symfony was because I thought it would take too long to learn). I chose Symfony because it is already integrated with Doctrine (and I wasted too much time attempting to integrate it with Zend - otherwise I really like Zend). After about 3 weeks of reading and trial-and-error I am feeling really comfortable with the 1.4 release. Sure 2.0 is much closer to Java Seam/Hibernate/JPA than 1.4 but what I am learning now with allow me to really leverage 2.0 since I will carry so much Symfony knowledge with me - and I will be back in a familiar ORM world with Doctrine 2.0 (so much like Hibernate its scary). I really, really like Symfony - it truly Rocks!
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